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Re: [TCML] JAVATC & tuning
Bart, sorry disregard the reply I sent to you earlier. I didn't save the Designer info properly, so the attachments are no good. Below are the specs on my coil. Any insight you could offer on the tuning discerpancy would be appreciated. Regards, Dennis
J A V A T C version 12.4 - CONSOLIDATED OUTPUT
Wednesday, April 07, 2010 8:04:14 PM
Units = Inches
Ambient Temp = 68°F
----------------------------------------------------
Surrounding Inputs:
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159 = Ground Plane Radius
159 = Wall Radius
108 = Ceiling Height
----------------------------------------------------
Secondary Coil Inputs:
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Current Profile = G.PROFILE_LOADED
3.31 = Radius 1
3.31 = Radius 2
20.25 = Height 1
50.125 = Height 2
1516 = Turns
0.0159 = Wire Diameter
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Primary Coil Inputs:
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Round Primary Conductor
4.8 = Radius 1
13.49 = Radius 2
19.5 = Height 1
19.5 = Height 2
17.3686 = Turns
0.25 = Wire Diameter
0 = Ribbon Width
0 = Ribbon Thickness
0.015 = Primary Cap (uF)
54 = Total Lead Length
0.02 = Lead Diameter
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Top Load Inputs:
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Toroid #1: minor=6, major=20.5, height=57, topload
Toroid #2: minor=3, major=12, height=52, topload
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Secondary Outputs:
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106.34 kHz = Secondary Resonant Frequency
90 deg° = Angle of Secondary
29.88 inch = Length of Winding
50.7 inch = Turns Per Unit
0.00381 inch = Space Between Turns (edge to edge)
2627.4 ft = Length of Wire
4.51:1 = H/D Aspect Ratio
106.9019 Ohms = DC Resistance
49578 Ohms = Reactance at Resonance
2.01 lbs = Weight of Wire
74.201 mH = Les-Effective Series Inductance
79.169 mH = Lee-Equivalent Energy Inductance
77.83 mH = Ldc-Low Frequency Inductance
30.188 pF = Ces-Effective Shunt Capacitance
28.294 pF = Cee-Equivalent Energy Capacitance
47.388 pF = Cdc-Low Frequency Capacitance
9.44 mils = Skin Depth
22.326 pF = Topload Effective Capacitance
172.9583 Ohms = Effective AC Resistance
287 = Q
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Primary Outputs:
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106.35 kHz = Primary Resonant Frequency
0 % = Percent Detuned
0 deg° = Angle of Primary
83.17 ft = Length of Wire
13.8 mOhms = DC Resistance
0.25 inch = Average spacing between turns (edge to edge)
1.535 inch = Proximity between coils
1.77 inch = Recommended minimum proximity between coils
147.453 µH = Ldc-Low Frequency Inductance
0.01498 µF = Cap size needed with Primary L (reference)
2.342 µH = Lead Length Inductance
416.295 µH = Lm-Mutual Inductance
0.123 k = Coupling Coefficient
0.137 k = Recommended Coupling Coefficient
8.13 = Number of half cycles for energy transfer at K
37.86 µs = Time for total energy transfer (ideal quench time)
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Transformer Inputs:
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120 [volts] = Transformer Rated Input Voltage
15000 [volts] = Transformer Rated Output Voltage
60 [mA] = Transformer Rated Output Current
60 [Hz] = Mains Frequency
140 [volts] = Transformer Applied Voltage
0 [amps] = Transformer Ballast Current
0 [ohms] = Measured Primary Resistance
0 [ohms] = Measured Secondary Resistance
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Transformer Outputs:
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900 [volt*amps] = Rated Transformer VA
250000 [ohms] = Transformer Impedence
17500 [rms volts] = Effective Output Voltage
8.75 [rms amps] = Effective Transformer Primary Current
0.07 [rms amps] = Effective Transformer Secondary Current
1225 [volt*amps] = Effective Input VA
0.0106 [uF] = Resonant Cap Size
0.0159 [uF] = Static gap LTR Cap Size
0.0277 [uF] = SRSG LTR Cap Size
166 [uF] = Power Factor Cap Size
24749 [peak volts] = Voltage Across Cap
61872 [peak volts] = Recommended Cap Voltage Rating
4.59 [joules] = Primary Cap Energy
249.9 [peak amps] = Primary Instantaneous Current
50.6 [inch] = Spark Length (JF equation using Resonance Research Corp. factors)
88.9 [peak amps] = Sec Base Current
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Rotary Spark Gap Inputs:
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0 = Number of Stationary Gaps
0 = Number of Rotating Electrodes
0 [rpm] = Disc RPM
0 = Rotating Electrode Diameter
0 = Stationary Electrode Diameter
0 = Rotating Path Diameter
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Rotary Spark Gap Outputs:
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0 = Presentations Per Revolution
0 [BPS] = Breaks Per Second
0 [mph] = Rotational Speed
0 [ms] = RSG Firing Rate
0 [ms] = Time for Capacitor to Fully Charge
0 = Time Constant at Gap Conduction
0 [µs] = Electrode Mechanical Dwell Time
0 [%] = Percent Cp Charged When Gap Fires
0 [peak volts] = Effective Cap Voltage
0 [joules] = Effective Cap Energy
0 [peak volts] = Terminal Voltage
0 [power] = Energy Across Gap
0 [inch] = RSG Spark Length (using energy equation)
----------------------------------------------------
Static Spark Gap Inputs:
----------------------------------------------------
5 = Number of Electrodes
1 [inch] = Electrode Diameter
0.12 [inch] = Total Gap Spacing
----------------------------------------------------
Static Spark Gap Outputs:
----------------------------------------------------
0.03 [inch] = Gap Spacing Between Each Electrode
24749 [peak volts] = Charging Voltage
10804 [peak volts] = Arc Voltage
38355 [volts] = Voltage Gradient at Electrode
90033 [volts/inch] = Arc Voltage per unit
43.7 [%] = Percent Cp Charged When Gap Fires
4.11 [ms] = Time To Arc Voltage
243 [BPS] = Breaks Per Second
0.88 [joules] = Effective Cap Energy
248762 [peak volts] = Terminal Voltage
213 [power] = Energy Across Gap
47.3 [inch] = Static Gap Spark Length (using energy equation)
-----Original Message-----
From: bartb <bartb@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: Tesla Coil Mailing List <tesla@xxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tue, Apr 6, 2010 10:47 pm
Subject: Re: [TCML] JAVATC & tuning
Hi Dennis,
Tuning will vary a little with surroundings (external capacitance) depending on the items nearby and even the coils sensitivity to extC. 2 turns is a bit much, so I understand your reason to question it. I've found (and many others) that a coil runs better when the primary is tuned for more L. Thus, it is actually "detuned" as far as coil to coil oscillation is based on their component values and derivations. I've run as far as 13% detuned on the primary in the coils I've built. In your case, your also running high on primary inductance as indicated by "more" turns. There are two main reasons why this occurs: 1) spark length and it's external capacitance affect on the coil. 2) External objects affecting the coil itself. Beyond these main issues, there is also a 3rd. If the coil is relatively small in size, the primary L is often very small. Thus, a little extC can greatly affect tuning. This aspect is difficult to understand until you actually try it.
In the end, what matters is your best spark length. Don't worry so much if a programs tuning is not perfect for your coil. Programs are using the best information they have, however, there's only so much data that a program can input that is practical for coilers. There is a point where more accuracy would require some odd measurements that most would not be up for or have the capabilities to do.
I would like if you sent me your coil specs however. A Javatc output would be good.
I haven't been checking my emails as often as I use to. I've been rather lazy with TCML this year. I do poke my head in now and then. I'll try to do better in the future.
Very best regards,
Bart B. Anderson
otmaskin5@xxxxxxx wrote:
> Hey guys - I just built a built a 6" secondary & installed on my 15/60 system (replaced the old 4" secondary). I ran it on Sunday & like the way it's performed so far. I've got the static gap set conservatively at 0.12", & will gradually open in up as I get more confident everything is in balance & working the way it should be...which brings me to my question. JAVATC indicates optimal tuning at 17.3 primary turns. I started there but didn't get any sparks at all. Eventually after trial & error tuning I found the optimal primary tap point at 19.3 turns, 2 full turns more than JAVATC indicated. The coil seemed to run smooth at 19.3 turns and I didn't detect problems to indicate the anything was significantly out of tune. >
> In the past, JAVATC has always proven to be right on the money or within a quarter turn of where I've found the actual tuning point. So I'm thinking I'm doing something wrong here - 2 full turns seems like major difference. I've gone back, checked & confirmed all the inputs (physical dimensions & elevations) and I've run the program a few times always getting the same result - 17.3 turns. It's really bugging me like something's just not right. Any ideas on what else I might look to resolve the discrepancy? >
> Thanks for any ideas, Dennis Hopkinton MA
>
>
>
>
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