[TCML] Coil V5 - first light

Sat Oct 23 14:31:00 MDT 2010

Hi Brent,
	Well put.  To clarify when I say less energy per bang I'm implying use 
of a smaller cap to accommodate a higher break rate, so more but smaller 
breaks, same average power.  Good thoughts nonetheless, Interesting 
secondary geometry (is it a magnifier?) do you have some pictures of 
your system, I'd love to see them, 6 feet is pretty darn good for 4kW, 
and a system that runs for 12 years is a real accomplishment, I'd like 
to see construction details for implementation in my future designs.  A 
magnifier is my next tesla project on my list, for now I've been 
concentrating on plasma stuff, learning a bit of glassblowing.

Scott Bogard.

On 10/23/2010 2:50 PM, bturner at apcx.net wrote:
> Some comments -
>
> Tight coupling and high break rates results in approximating CW operation
> - this is what Tesla was doing with the magnifier system. A high-power CW
> 'master oscillator' end-feeding the free-resonant 'extra coil'.
>
> Faster break rates don't really dimish the discharge energy unless the
> break rate is faster than the 'ring-up' time in the secondary. (Hence WHY
> maggies use tight coupling AND high break rates - not a matter of maximum
> secondary voltage, rather, maximum secondary CURRENT.) Another thing that
> is often overlooked in RSG's is the conduction -- dwell -- time. THAT is
> more important than the break rate in reference to coupling and ring-up
> times. Match the dwell angle to the ring-up time and the efficiency starts
> to really climb.
>
> I am now running my system at 600 bps(!) full synchronous, 0.06uf, 12Kv
> input. I still get effective ring-up, no drop in voltage, but the high rep
> rate packs a whole lot more energy per second into the discharges - BRIGHT
> WHITE arcs to ground and 6+ feet in length. Not bad for 4Kw input, and the
> secondary coil is only 10" diameter and 20" in winding height (2:1)...
> Hasn't broken down yet in over 12 years of operation...
>
> - brent turner
>
>
>
>> Remember Joe, with higher BPS you can shoot for a much higher coupling.
>>    Yet another reason I hate SRSG, I used to get racing arcs with a loose
>> 0.12 coupling, with my ASRSG, I don't and my coupling is a whopping 0.16
>> (the primary sits a half inch ABOVE the bottom of the secondary!)  This
>> higher coupling makes your arcs sooo much brighter it isn't even funny,
>> I can see them in near daylight!  Keep this in mind, higher break rate,
>> smaller bangs, less energy per bang, bye bye racing sparks.  Remember
>> every change you make transforms the coil into a whole different animal,
>> throw established knowledge out of the window and test to form new
>> assumptions, just don't forget what you've learned so you can retest old
>> assumptions on different configurations.
>>
>> Scott Bogard.
>>
>>
>> On 10/23/2010 11:00 AM, Joe Mastroianni wrote:
>>> Hi David,
>>>
>>> JavaTC suggests the optimal coupling is in the 0.14 range.  However, for
>>> my prior, now extinct secondary, I got killer arcs when I got close to
>>> that.  Could have been cause by other issues - like the fact I put
>>> 0.12uF of cap in the tank. (now running 0.06uF)   But I'm wary of higher
>>> k.  Every time I mess with getting close to 0.14 or 0.13, I get badness.
>>>
>>> I am going to measure the k directly, today, and will post the numbers.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Joe
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Oct 23, 2010, at 4:24 AM, David Rieben wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Joe,
>>>>
>>>> Although this has nothing to do with your Dolphs "bubbling up
>>>> on you", I did notice that your physical primary/secondary coupling
>>>> looks rather loose to me. Your calculated k = .09 is probably "in
>>>> the ballpark" but to my understanding, around .12 to .15 is usually
>>>> considered in the optimal range for medium to larger SG driven
>>>> coils. IIRC, the top plane of the copper tubing primary of my
>>>> Green Monster coil system lies only about 1.5" below the level
>>>> of my lowest seondary turn and this seems to work great for me
>>>> (no racing sparks but plenty of good energy transfer).
>>>>
>>>> David Rieben
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe
>>>> Mastroianni"<joe at killerowls.com>
>>>> To: "Tesla Coil Mailing List"<tesla at pupman.com>
>>>> Sent: Friday, October 22, 2010 8:18 PM
>>>> Subject: [TCML] Coil V5 - first light
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> http://yfrog.com/n2rrfj
>>>>
>>>> 8.5" x 34" secondary.  919 turns of heavy build 20ga.  6" x 24" toroid
>>>> Using the same dreaded ribbon primary because I didn't want to have to
>>>> build a new one yet.  Spacing between the top of the ribbon and the
>>>> first turn of the secondary is 3.75".  k=0.09 calculated (not yet
>>>> measured).  ARSG.  Pig running at about 30A.
>>>> Sparks seem to be in the 6-7' range, but have yet to mount the larger
>>>> toroid I'm working on.
>>>>
>>>> Basically, needed to replace my 6.25"x24" secondary that burned last
>>>> weekend.
>>>>
>>>> Problem with this secondary is that the Dolphs bubbled up on me.  It
>>>> went on w/o bubbles, and they emerged later.   I coated all week, at
>>>> least 1 coat per day.   Could it have happened because it is much
>>>> colder out then when I wound my prior secondaries?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Joe_______________________________________________
>>>> Tesla mailing list
>>>> Tesla at pupman.com
>>>> http://www.pupman.com/mailman/listinfo/tesla
>>>>
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>
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