[TCML] cap rms current
drieben at att.net
Thu Feb 2 16:34:40 MST 2012
Agreed, Carl. I was originally running a
Hipotronics .1 uFd, 50 kV rated unit that
was right "good looking", but it died to an
internal short/flashover, without the fanfare
of case rupture and spewing of its hot, oily
guts. The Maxwell seems darn near inde-
structable, though, at least for the type of
abuse that the Green Monster goves it.
I think Joe Mastroianni did have some
of the 37667 (.03 uFd, 35 kV rated) Max-
wells to fail on him, but after discussing
this issue with him, we came to realize that
a 35 kV rating is running on the razor's edge
of a safe ceiling voltage rating when firing with
a 14.4 kV pig. Of course, from Joe's description
of his failure mode, it sounds as if he had an over-
current problem and not necessarily over-voltage.?
I would assume that case rupture with the coil still
operating after rupture is an over-current issue.
My Hipotronics cap never showed any external
signs of failure, just the spark output of my coil
came to a sudden and abrupt stop! That sounds
more symptomatic of an over-volting incident.
Seems that I've heard that a good "rule of thumb" is
to make sure that the DC voltage rating of the pulse
cap is at least 3X the maximum AC rms voltage that
you will be feeding it. Since I run the input to my 14.4
kV pig overdriven with up to 280 volts from a variac,
that means that the 50 kV rating of my original
Hipotronics cap was cutting it too close, too.
BTW, Cameron Prince has a big SG driven
coil that is very similar to mine in power con-
sumption and performance and he also had
his original Hipotronics .1 uFd, 50 uFd cap
to bite the bullet in his, too. He too now
utilizes one of those 31885 .1 uFd, 75 kV
rated Maxwells in his coil and he too likes ;^)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carl Noggle" <cn at q.com>
To: "Tesla Coil Mailing List" <tesla at pupman.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2012 10:10 AM
Subject: Re: [TCML] cap rms current
> These Maxwell caps are bulletproof. I bought a 0.05uF, 50kV cap about
> 20 years ago knowing that it had a leak around the top terminals, and it
> finally gave up the ghost about two weeks ago, after much service in my
> TC, 1800 watts from three 9/60s in parallel. I got a nonleaking one at
> the same time and it is still going strong.
>> trying to start/move the thread
>> I have a cat # 31885, .1 ufd, 75 kV rated Maxwell
>> that I believe is also rated at a "mere" 25 amps RMS,
>> but I run my Green Monster coil (10 kVA pig fed
>> and overdriven up to 20 kVA) with it as the sole
>> primary cap and I have never been able to notice
>> any external warmth on it above ambient temp,
>> even after several minutes of non-stop 15 kVA +
>> David Rieben
>> Assuming your pig is 14.4kV, at 15kVA it's roughly 1 Amp RMS "into the
>> Now, the question comes up of "what's the effective RMS current in the
>> cap". I like to back of the envelope these kinds of things by doing
>> an energy balance kind of computation.
>> Let's, say, for argument that your coil runs at 100kHz, and takes
>> about 10 cycles to go from "break" to "quench", or, call it 100
>> So, during a 8.3 millisecond half cycle, the cap is "charging" at 1
>> amp (from the pig) for most of it, and then, for 0.1 millisecond it is
>> discharging ALL that stored energy.
>> That is, in round numbers, it spends 99% of the time charging and 1%
>> of the time discharging.
>> We know that energy goes as the square of either voltage or current,
>> so the RMS current during discharge is going to be 1/10th of the RMS
>> current during charging (since we already know that the energy flow
>> ratio is 100:1)
>> therefore, I would assume that you're running an effective RMS current
>> of somewhere between 10-15 Amps, well within the rating of your
>> Maxwell cap.
>> Somewhere back in the archives, there's a better calculation of this.
>> I integrated a variety of damped sinusoids (linear and exponential
>> decrement). It would be pretty easy for someone to set up an excel
>> spreadsheet and do it by numerical integration, as well.
>> Tesla mailing list
>> Tesla at pupman.com
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