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Re: Ion Motors / Electrostatic Pendulum



Original poster: "Christopher Boden by way of Terry Fritz <twftesla-at-qwest-dot-net>" <chrisboden-at-hotmail-dot-com>





>Original poster: "Antonio Carlos M. de Queiroz by way of Terry Fritz 
><twftesla-at-qwest-dot-net>" <acmq-at-compuland-dot-com.br>
>
>Tesla list wrote:
> >
> > Original poster: "Christopher Boden" <chrisboden-at-hotmail-dot-com>
> >...
> > I noticed you use only 2 electrodes in your setup. Get another ball and
> > place it opposite the pendulum so that they arc at the top (Apogee?) of 
>each
> > swing. I have my dendulum swinging a continuous 2' or more. I'm 
>wondering
> > the effect if I connect it to the 13.8kV 10kVA Pig :) I'm setting up a
> > permeant version of this in a tiny, windowed room.
> >
> > While nowhere near a dynamic as a Coil, this simple machine is 
>facinateing
> > to watch......relaxing......like a Geek version of an aquarium :)
>
>The setup surely works with two fixed terminals too (I didn't try yet).

That's what I ment :) You use balls for both the "Ball" and the stationary 
electrodes. I use pop cans, and have also used a pair of computer-room 
raised flooring pedestals with hard drive plattens on them (looked nice).

>Curiously, it works in the same way, but driven by electrostatic
>forces, if I use an electrostatic machine as power source. But only
>if the current is very small. With higher current the pendulum just
>remains suspended close to the fixed ball while sparks flow. The heat
>of the arc is not enough to push it away.
>

With Balls as the electrodes your raising the air temp (and pressure) 
between the balls and sucking them together.

Geek Science Demo:

Suspend a pair of your balls so that they hang about 2cm apart at rest. 
Stick a soda-straw between them and blow. They will suck together as the air 
pressure drops.


Your spark is doing this do a smaller degree (you must have light balls, 
they look like floats for a switch, similar to what we used for the first 
pendulum, now we use bronze). If your ball is to light it won't have enough 
weight to pull it back down, but we've never had this problem. I believe you 
need to stationary electrodes to increase the swing of your ball, then 
"Sticking" won't be a problem.

> > Now....how can the energy of a coil be turned into electromotive force?
>
>Doesn´t seem very practical.
>
> > Ion motors work, the B.L.P. works...but they are both VERY inefficiant
> > devices. 90% of the energy is being wasted as heat/light.
>
>Not necessarily. Ion motors were developed for use in space. Maybe
>a Tesla coil can be used in the energy conversion to power an ionic
>drive.



That is the purpose of this experimentation, a practical application for a 
coil. Right now we're learning to crawl.




>
> > I'm NOT trying to
> > get into that "Free Energy From the Aether" stuff. I believe in the laws 
>of
> > thermodynamics (my room is a textbook exampe of the 2nd). I would just 
>like
> > to see something with, perhaps 50% efficiancy. I'm not interested in 
>getting
> > out more than I put in or anythinhg like that (Though I'd be happy to 
>see
> > someone do it :) Just because it hasn't happened yet doesn't mean it 
>can't),
>
>It can't. Otherwise you would see it happening in some natural process,
>and Nature would be so mad that we would not be here...
>
> > and there are a LOT of interesting things we're still learning with 
>coils
> > and energy. Unusual breakouts from unpowered coils and such. And I have 
>a
> > sneaking suspicion Mr. Wysock has something really big brewing over 
>there on
> > the left coast.
> > I'm quite content to help push along some progress in the lower power 
>side
> > of things. Even if we get nothing more than an electronic toy like a 
>better
> > ion motor......I happen to love toys. :)
>
>If you want to try a "practical application" for a Tesla coil circuit,
>in the fringe of the technically infeasible (as several famous Tesla's
>ideas) try something as an inverted Tesla coil (high-voltage input -
>low-voltage, high-current, output). The main objective would be to
>capture
>energy from lightning, but you can avoid the huge technical problems
>with a device that just demonstrates the basic idea, taking an arc from
>a conventional coil and converting the energy back to an usable form.
>
>Antonio Carlos M. de Queiroz

Great idea, and something I've been kicking around with the Group for years. 
But I will have to use a Coil for preliminary tests and Harpo (our Megavolt 
Marx bank of 220 lbs caps) for the actual proving of the theory I would 
think, sone Coils produce AC and Lightning is DC, and MUCH higher powered.

People on the list have made HUGE advances in coil design and output over 
the years, especially recently. I love to watch the new designs come into 
play and get studied. When I came on half the posts were about Rolled Poly 
caps....when was the last time you saw one of those? I watched MMCs spread 
like wildfire thanks to the pioneering work of Terry and a few brave souls. 
Now Gaps are the thing, I see Triggered gaps and SS gaps on the horizon, 
with the work of Marc and others leading the way (Terry once again with his 
SS gap). The Tesla list has made great strides in getting the output up 
there.

Now I wanna answer that nagging questions from the PFY....

What do we DO with it? :)

Sparks are cool, and I love watching them. Especially when you break the 6' 
barrier, then they get REALLY cool. But I'm greedy, we're all working on 
bigger and getter ways to horribly bastardize Nick's greatest dream (He 
didn't build his to make sparks, we're doing it wrong!). His work was 
focused on the Before Breakout condition as I understand it, and with the 
other things going on (The NoCal thread) it seems that there may be a lot of 
coilers playing in the before breakout (<B?) condition.

I wonder what the 13M can do to surrounding things just before breakout? How 
about Electrum? Have you guys noted anything strange in the moments just 
before breakout?

duck




Christopher A. Boden Geek#1
President / C.E.O. / Alpha Geek
The Geek Group
www.thegeekgroup-dot-org
Because the Geek shall inherit the Earth!



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