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Re: avalon condition



>Original poster: "Metlicka Marc" <mystuffs-at-orwell-dot-net>
>
>hello chris,
>after reading mark broker's post on the complex's condition, i have to
>say that this is somewhat what i expected. of coarse living relatively
>close to the, now coming back, mahoning valley steel district, i've seen
>some sad building restorations.
>in fact we spent over a year reconstituting an old "blooming" mill
>facility that mark's description fit to a tee. holes in the floor that
>would swallow my van and drop it 30' to the basement floor, roofing that
>looked like a screen door.

It's not ALL that bad :) And the holes in the floor *are* intentional. I 
have toured almost 80% of the complex (it's taken me 2 weeks!) and most of 
the work will be in CLEANOUT. There will b a lot to do in the Remodel phase, 
but not much as far as serious structural work (other than 2nd level 
construction (plumbing, Electrical, NLB-walls, Cosmetic). There is a fair 
amout of roofing to be done. Mostly old water damage, rotting, the usual for 
a building that has sat abandoned for 15 years.


>we approached it in basically the same manor suggested by terry and mark
>except, you don't want to be removed from grid power except as a last
>resort, once disconnected you will be held to all the safety and code
>guide lines that a new installation requires.
>remain connected, the cost to physically disconnect from the grid is not
>worth it.

This is true. I have the ability to shut down myself with a couple of large 
switches.


>find the sub mcc's and break power there. find the rectifier room and
>disconnect the crane's hot rails, drop out the cans for the overhead
>aerials.

That was done years ago.

>get some one that is not afraid of heights,

I'm a rock climber Marc ;)

safety harness him up, get
>him to walk the crane decks and rolling rail's

I've walked a couple of them already. They're in great shape. They look lik 
streetcar rail.

(i hated when the crane
>broke down in the middle of the bay, by the time i finally got to the
>crane i was usually crawling)

Yeah, they don't give ya a lot of room up there. In th HVL the crane goes 
less than 1/2" under the superstructure for the roof.

these overhead cranes are the work horses
>and you'll need them for clean up and high bay lighting repair.

lol, yeah. Without them (or a scissors lift) there *is* no way to change 
most of the lights in the big rooms.

a good
>compressor in the rectifier room,

Just what IS the Rectifier Room? Would it be a room with HV feeds in posts 
coming out of the floor going into cubish boxy things about 1.5cuft with 6 
BIG wires coming out ther top and a lever on the front?

There are a couple rooms with a HV jungle gym of pipes onto witch several 
rows of these boxes are mounted. There (once were) 6 large wires going into 
each box (they have long since been cut). On the front of the fall of jungle 
gym is a wooden handled lever contraption that does something IN each box. 
They MIGHT be switches, but they just don't feel right as a switch. Bit I 
couldn't imagine what else they could be.
Why would anyone want a lever on a rectifier?


clean everything. if you have a good
>480 feed use it, i know the cable on the ground scare's you but power is
>everything.

We ARE using it. I just want to get it in the air a bit. I'm worried about 
running it over and grounding it out. That's the only power in Mill-C right 
now.


check the cable tray's, a good four conductor running in
>your general direction can be a blessing.

there are LOTS of theses pink (once red?) 3"dia(total) 4cond cables running 
everywhere at about all elevations. I believe they carried 14.4 for the 
primaries.


>find the "plant one line drawing's" after my post i called an et at a
>steel mill and he told me that they have to submit any updates to the
>one line's to the local power co., check with them they might still have
>them in archive?

ha ha ha...yeah...you have to meet the CP rep. I'll call Consumers, but I'mm 
willing to bet the following will happen.

1. They DO have an archive, but noone I will ever get to talk to will know 
that. That person won't check either, and will vehemntly deny ever hearing 
anything about it.

2. They DO have an archive, but it doesn't go back before 1987 since they 
started computerising all their records and the old ons were dstroyed in a 
fire.

3. They Never had an archive...but that's a good idea and perhaps we'll 
start one!

4. I starve to death waiting on hold.


Pick one, I give 50:50 odds on any of them.


gas is a definite shut down for now,(the heat is in the
>tools).

Alright dad..... ;)

but do it at the plant's mains,

With the hissing leaks at the mains I'M NOT TOUCHING A 200PSI+ 8" GAS MAIN. 
I'm allergic to pain. When they fix it, THEN yes. But that could take weeks. 
I already have closed EVERY valve I could find. Water, Gas, God knows what.


don't let the gas co. do it,

The Gas Co (Consumers...yeah, same as the Electric monopoly in town) 
couldn't even FIND the mains. I had to show them the pit (which is their 
property) AND the meters.
Next time, I'm moving the meters and they can find them on their own.


>you'll be right back to the new guide line mess, stay as much on the
>"existing operation" platform as you can.  look in the mcr's for any
>delta/wye transformers that look disconnected, these can be relocated to
>any area and fed for work power, the cleanup crew will need power and
>lights to expedite the process.

Yes, what I'm hoping to do is get the primary trannis on (14.4KV to 2400) 
then be able to power one building at a time. We'll work on Generators for 
now, but I'm sorting the mess out as fast as I can.



>i guess what i'm trying to say is if you disconnect from the grid, you
>may never get back on. these guy's would love for you to say "unhook us
>for now" that is major dollar sign's in there eye's, the one's that seem
>to be friendly now will be the one's that say "you'll need an inspection
>and this wont pass and that wont pass" believe me.

Oh I believe you, been there before. The BIG thing going in my favour today 
is the Fire System. EVERYTHING I seen in th FSS is mint. It must have been 
installed about 6 years ago. The pepes are all empty (as are the water 
mains, thank God) and in great shape.


>if those alis chalmers transformers are hot, use them. if not don't get
>rid of them, keep all the transformers, vacuum breakers, all. find an
>area that is dry and store them. from the smallest control trans. to the
>ugliest disconnect, temporary service is the key here.

I'll have to see if I can find some room to put them. ;)

Alright. Most of the PIGS stay where they are (that's where I need them 
anyways). But let's say I want to move a few. Can a BobCat do it? How? If I 
tip it will it die? How much can they tip? What do I have to secure before 
lifting? Some of the big ones have a drain valve, should I 
drain-move-refill? I CAN safely handle the PCBs (we have Tyvex suits if we 
need them, with booties, gloves, and mask)



>get the cranes going and keep quiet, remember "a fool can pass for a
>wise man, if he only holds his tongue"
>marc

We don't have to kep quiet. EVRYBODY from God on down seems to want to help 
us in every possible way. I have people I never heard of calling me from the 
city asking if I knew about such and such funding availible and they will 
send me a packet. It's really cool :)

Marc, how would YOU like to come and sort out the HV system, fight the 
cranes, and all that Jazz?

Good news, only 3 of the Gantries are electric. The rest we have to convert 
:) Right now it's pulling chain. And to move a 50ton crane, that is 60' 
long, across a 114' room you have to pull a LOT of chain. It takes 4 people 
about 20 mins if they're in a hurry.



Christopher A. Boden Geek#1
President / Founder
The Geek Group
www.geekgroup-dot-org
Because the Geek shall inherit the Earth!

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